Let's Talk Money Feat: Bob Wheeler

Dustin Steffey: 0:00

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Jaden Norvell: 1:13

welcome back to chopping with fire the number one podcast for entrepreneurship, self development and smart business investments. This podcast has accolades and include a nomination for Best Business Podcast but a 2022 People's Choice Awards, over 25,000 downloads and six months a global support network and over $5,000 raised for the Cystic Fibrosis Foundation hosted by yours truly Jaden rush Norville, also hosted and created by the man himself Dr. Dustin Steffey Welcome to chop with fire Let's chop it up

Dustin Steffey: 2:07

Hello, and welcome to another episode of chopping wood fire. You're joined with your hosts today Dustin Steffey and Jaden Norvell. So with that being said I wanted to get a couple announcements out of the way before we go through and have our exciting guest speaker first and foremost we do have venue locked for our live event on November 18. Again, mark your calendars and November 18 at 5pm that chase your dreams a live event at Canvas Stadium in Fort Collins Colorado. If you guys haven't done so already, check out our Instagram Twitter or Facebook for the link book your ticket today. All proceeds are going to be split between the Boys and Girls Club and the Cystic Fibrosis Foundation. Head on over to C F F dot O R G forward slash Donate today Boys and Girls Club they give back to kids take a look at both of those charities. today. We also have a website WWW dot chopping with fire that ch o p p i n with feiyr.com you can email us comment. Lastly, please head on over to Patreon that's WWW dot Patreon pa t ar e o n.com forward slash chopping with fire. I think that about does our announcements. I'm excited because I want to dive right into it. Our guest speaker today is a first speaker that we've had on it is not a repeat, I am excited to announce that he is a well accomplished CPA. He is also the CFO for the world famous Comedy Store. He graduated from Rhodes College in Memphis, Tennessee. And his passion project right now is the money nerve.com where he discusses navigating the emotions of money. Obviously, we're going to dive into that. But without further ado, I would like to introduce Bob Wheeler, Bob, how are you?

Bob Wheeler: 4:02

I'm doing great. Glad to be here.

Dustin Steffey: 4:04

Thank you for coming on with us my friend.

Bob Wheeler: 4:07

Absolutely. Let's talk money.

Dustin Steffey: 4:10

Let's talk about you first I want I want people to understand like who you are and how you got to this journey first. Yeah,

Bob Wheeler: 4:17

absolutely. So I was very determined to be a lawyer. And I was taking accounting classes to help my grade point average. And, you know, I had a belief that you have to work really hard and you can't enjoy what you do. So couldn't be an accountant even though it was something that came easy to me. It was really just helped me out. Met a few lawyers decided I didn't want to go in that direction. Didn't really want to stay in school. Jumped into public accounting initially because I thought it would help me figure out what other small business I would like to run right I could be doing everybody else's books, seeing who's making the money who's losing the money. I didn't realize I would make a business of taxes. is and so it sort of grew, you know, I grew up to I've got about 1000 tax clients brought on a business partner, and it's just been growing for me to about, I think we've got like 15 people. And we work with a lot of entrepreneurs, that's sort of my niche, is helping people make the most of their tax situation and their income situation. What happened for me, I got into, you know, I was, I was not following my own advice, telling everybody else what to do, but I wasn't doing it. started looking at that started looking at people going out and doing the exact the exact opposite of what I thought was really sound advice, and realized, if I didn't understand where they were coming from Emotionally, I wasn't going to get anywhere, because that's what drives us often is the unconscious money stories that we have. And our you know, your story has a cost. And so if we can start to figure out your story, and then figure out if you're willing to pay that cost, or if it's a good price, or if we need to find another story that serves us better. And so that's been my passion is really just trying to connect people with their emotional and potentially financial trauma around money, and helping people to have a healthy relationship with money and be their best versions of themselves.

Dustin Steffey: 6:21

It's funny, you mentioned about taking classes to get your GPA up, because accounting would not be the first class that I would take to get my GPA up. I took the like 201202 accountings, and I was like, yep, hard pass.

Bob Wheeler: 6:34

Yeah. Now, I hear you. I was a little weird. I took Latin and accounting. Those are my two. Round up the grades.

Dustin Steffey: 6:42

My my grade razors, were organizational behavior and psychology classes. There you

Bob Wheeler: 6:48

go. Probably should have gone that route.

Dustin Steffey: 6:51

They were they were fun routes. That's Chris. Sure.

Bob Wheeler: 6:54

For sure. For sure.

Dustin Steffey: 6:57

So let's Let's talk money, you brought up a really big topic that probably encompasses a lot of things, which is emotions behind spending money. Yep. Let's let's dive into kind of a little bit about that. Because when I think about it, how my money habits are, in my opinion, are my examples were my parents, right? My dad was a gambler. My mom didn't have a job, we were bouncing from house to house, he didn't have money, we didn't have electricity, we didn't have food. And therefore, my lifestyle was very poor. And so for me, it's been different because I don't ever want to live that. So I've really thought about like, how do I not live that? And so for me, it's the drive of I don't gamble. And I live in the state of Nevada, because my dad already did that. And I watched it. And all my money goes towards bills and lots of bills.

Bob Wheeler: 7:57

Yeah, well see, that's interesting thing too, people could have different reactions, you had a reaction of I don't want to ever live that again. Thank you for the example. Clearly, I don't want to go that route, that other people might take that information and say, You know what, this is my lot in life, I'm stuck with it. I am my parents. And I'm just going to have to accept that I'll never get anywhere beyond this. And and so two people could be responding completely differently, but from the same from the same set of circumstance. And so being able to understand that being able to say, look, I'm okay with everything, or now I'd like it to be different. It's not about judging the choices we've made. It's about being curious. And it's about figuring out what serves us. That's working out for me, that's not working out for me, I think I'm gonna move over here, I'd like to have a little more income. And a lot of people it's interesting, a lot of clients, I, you know, ask them, what's their mindset? If they get 500 bucks? Are they figuring out what they can buy? Or are they figuring out what they can save? Or where they can invest? So if they're coming from a consumer mindset, they might be thinking, oh, man, I could get that upgrade on my computer. An investor mindset would say, oh, man, I could buy some stocks with that I could buy that'll go towards a little bit more towards my gold purchases. And so starting to just become aware of, Wow, I'm a spender. I'm a saver. What's true for me around money?

Dustin Steffey: 9:27

Yeah, you bring up two more categories, right? Am I a spender? Or am I a saver? And for me, I grew up with nothing. So the caveat to growing up with nothing, is I want to have everything now. Right? And so in my mind, yes, my bills are paid, and I pay them every month, whether I'm working three jobs or 300. But I also am a spender. And I know that

Bob Wheeler: 9:54

and there's nothing wrong with that. I mean, here's the thing, that when I work with people It's not to tell them that they're good or bad. It's just to actually get them very aware of the choices they're making. So they can decide, Yeah, I'm good with these choices, or I'd like to do it a little bit different. And then Okay, great. If you want to do it different, how can we achieve that? So it's, it's this is always about choice. And it's always about, like, just being curious about our choices. And, you know, from an accounting point of view, what's the cost benefit? Right, the benefit is, I get to have whatever I want in the moment, at the cost of not being able to save for a house. Or it might be at the cost of stepping up into my leadership, because I'm afraid to take a management position, because I might have to speak in front of people, whatever it might be, but there's no right or wrong. It's just ah, that's interesting. That's interesting. I immediately go to fear, I immediately go to scarcity. I immediately go to not worry, the immediate like, whatever, it's everybody but me can get ahead. But my story is all never like, never get ahead. We've got inflation, I'm never gonna get ahead. The economy crashed. I'm never gonna get ahead. It's a story.

Dustin Steffey: 11:17

Yeah, I agree with that. I mean, there are too many stories where I hear for example, multilevel marketing, we all know what that is. It's the pyramid where everybody builds something, right. And the biggest, the biggest sales pitch I hear within multilevel marketing is, hey, if you're backed up to a corner, that's where you really find out who you are. And most of us succeeded in doing that, and now we're making millions,

Bob Wheeler: 11:43

right? It's true. I, you know, and for some people, that's the right route. For me, I was never comfortable with that. I was like, but, again, there's no right or wrong.

Dustin Steffey: 11:58

No, I don't discriminate on what people want to do. As far as their job pathway. There are a lot of successful multilevel marketing people, and they're very good at what they do, and bringing people into the fold. For me. I just never liked hitting up my family and friends to like, be able to, you know, hey, support me, and then everybody else support us. So they're supporting me too.

Bob Wheeler: 12:23

Yeah, no, it gets Oh, we had a family members like, Hey, you want to buy some tools? Hey, you want to but yeah, no, I don't. I really don't.

Dustin Steffey: 12:31

Yeah, no, I'll hard pass. I'll re got tools. We're good. Yeah.

Bob Wheeler: 12:35

And I don't want to see you in the holidays. Right, because I'm not buying.

Dustin Steffey: 12:40

You're not inviting for Christmas this year.

Bob Wheeler: 12:43

Yeah. Yeah. Sell it to somebody else. Yeah. Yeah.

Dustin Steffey: 12:48

No, you you bring up you bring up some good points. So I wrote down a couple. Everybody has a mindset that I feel like they're pre programmed with, right? Yeah. And it's about identifying it. So once you're self aware, because self awareness is a powerful tool, you can start making choices based off of that self awareness is where I'm gathering this so far.

Bob Wheeler: 13:11

Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. We want to know, what's the under voice like that voice, not the voice that says I want to be rich, but the one behind it that says, Not you, not happening for you. That's the voice I'm interested in because that's the voice that sabotages us. And then just starting to look at what are the words I'm choosing, I'm broke, I'm broke. You know, I might be cashflow negative at the moment, but I may not be broke, right. And so then, but we tend to in this day and age get into a victim story. Oh my god, it's so horrible. It's so horrible. I've only got three properties. And I have to go to Europe five times a year. And I have the newest car. It's so hard. Like, Wow, sounds rough, right? Instead of man. I'm grateful. I'm breathing, I'm alive. I, you know, I'm happy for whatever comes my way. Everything else is a bonus. Whatever that mindset is, but that's what's going to drive how we start our day, how we live our week, how we how we fare out by the end of the year,

Dustin Steffey: 14:11

I often revert back to things were easier as a child, which which Hear me out because you all know my childhood was rough. But the one thing that I didn't have to do was pay bills and be responsible for myself. Yes, I did to a certain degree, because of how I grew up, but not as much as I am now. I am fully independent right now and for me, like sometimes, it just would be nice to not be but that isn't how it works. Yeah,

Bob Wheeler: 14:41

unfortunately, and I think that's for a lot of people. Well, geez, if I get clear on my money that I have to be responsible and be self accountable. Yeah, you do. But it's a real nice payoff when you do it.

Dustin Steffey: 14:55

Yeah, I agree with that. I think and also I think like this is a good topic for me. One. But I also think it's extremely important even within the entrepreneurship realm, right? Because not only do you not have cash flow coming in from a normal nine to five anymore, because you're running your own business, and love to be smart about allocating that money, not only to keep the business sustainable, but to be able to pay for you to live to.

Bob Wheeler: 15:23

Yeah, and you know, when you're starting a business, and you have this great idea, and maybe the rest of the world doesn't have this great idea. They don't support that yet. Right? It may or may not be sustainable. And if you're in a story, you know, I had a client who, literally running his own business was really, he was not an entrepreneur. And him getting a check was just felt better for him. But when push came to shove, and the numbers were not looking good, I said, and he got offered an opportunity that would have gotten him out of all of his debt would have worked for another company. And in his case, it was probably the right choice. But his comment was, well, I can't close my business, my parents will be very disappointed. And he was already going down a path of the castle was gonna burn. It wasn't going to go, but he couldn't consciously make the choice to pivot, he had to just get engulfed in flames. And just and let himself become a victim. And so as an entrepreneur, you got to know when to call it quits, know when to accelerate know when to tolerate the pain and push through. Because as an entrepreneur, you know, you're you're typically trying to figure out, oh, that dollar could go to Marketing, no, that dollar could go to pay as an employee, that dollar could go to put the last gallon of gas in my car, whatever it might be, right, you're putting money into that business to get it to that level where it's become self sustaining.

Dustin Steffey: 16:57

And to remind the listeners, there's a difference between killing over and giving up prematurely. Right. And being self aware which, again, this is a common topic coming up for Bob and I self awareness, being self aware when the business is, it's just not making it you put every effort in, and it's just not making it.

Bob Wheeler: 17:21

Yeah, and it's, you know, you got, unfortunately, you don't got to do the work, but it really helps if you do the work. You know, I have a client had a client who they had this great idea. And they were selling salts, and they were gonna do these amazing things. But they never bothered to check if they actually had a market. Right. And so they're spending $100,000 on an accounting system and a couple 100,000 making it an exclusive deal with FedEx and kept saying, Look, this is great, your infrastructure is amazing. But how about gets some sales, and we'll worry about cleaning up everything else later with all the extra money, right. And they ultimately didn't succeed because they didn't check the market. Nobody was buying what they were selling. And you've, you got to explore all of that. You've got to wear multiple hats when you're an entrepreneur.

Dustin Steffey: 18:18

So you bring up another key topic, which is balance, right? Having the right balance in a business to be able to kind of balance that success, right. So for our podcasts, I'll use our podcast as an example. We could have the best microphones, the best equipment for sound, the best computers and everything. But if I'm terrible as a host, then the podcast is tanking. And that to our sales sales for a podcast is selling us ourselves. Right? If I cannot sell myself, then it doesn't matter what equipment I have. I can sell anything.

Bob Wheeler: 18:59

Yeah, exactly. And that's and then I think, as an entrepreneur, or any of us if we want to do the work, we sometimes have to hear painful information. Feedback, we don't want to hear what I'm not pretty. What? Oh, okay, well, good to know. Good to know. All right, I can work with that and take it in the spirit that it's given.

Dustin Steffey: 19:22

Right, you got to be open to the good in the bad. You have to be open for constructive, constructive criticism, right. Constructive criticism. There's the difference between constructive and pure criticism, right? You're and you can kind of figure out which one is which but the constructive one is to make you better.

Bob Wheeler: 19:40

Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely.

Dustin Steffey: 19:44

So in your experience with with the clients that you've had, which we're not going to name clients, but you have experiences obviously, what's the possible pattern? So what's the biggest pattern you've seen? Is it is is money spending driven by Eat childhood is driven by that little voice in the head that saying that you're always going to be unsuccessful. Like, what is the common theme that you see? So

Bob Wheeler: 20:12

regardless people, successful people, not successful people up and down, whatever it might be. This all goes back to childhood, in my opinion, because even the voice that saying you're not enough or whatever those programmings might be, those still also come from childhood, mostly. And they just kept getting reaffirmed. Yep, you're not worth it. Yeah, you're probably going to screw it up. Right? We all like to be right. So we're always gonna look for proof. To confirm, See, I knew I was a failure. I just needed three more pieces of information to reaffirm. Yep, I'm never gonna make it. And then we get to be right, because we love to be right. And so most of us as a kid, Hey, can I have that? Can I have this toy? You're greedy. Of course, honey, you're so special. You deserve anything you want. Anytime, great. I'm entitled, right? So it can be all the spectrum of you're greedy, you're, you're stupid, You're too naive. You're too giving all of those things, we take that and then we go into adulthood with our stories. And we've amplified them. And most of us are operating with information we got when we were five, six, and seven. And we probably need a computer update into our minds.

Dustin Steffey: 21:33

So it it all stems from childhood. So I was I was halfway. I was halfway on it then in the beginning with my childhood adventure. But I think there's another layer, right? So sure, we identified layer one, which is childhood. But I think there's the second layer, which is psychology, right? So what did what did we grow up seeing? So for me, I grew up seeing, and I grew up hearing. If I'm successful, it means I graduated from college, and I have a steady job and I'm making lots of money. And that was pounded in my head, even in high school, like, you need to go to college. And the more college you have, the more money you're gonna make. Well, folks, let me just tell you, that's false. It isn't. The more education you have, while I'm a proponent of higher education, and so are you, Bob, because you're a graduate as well, too. I'm definitely a proponent of higher education and educating yourself. I'm also a proponent of experience in the real world, to really understand how the world operates, and find that niche that you're good at, to make money and find success.

Bob Wheeler: 22:43

Yeah, and I would say probably people that are entrepreneurs and maybe people that didn't go on, to do it properly with an education might be more willing to think outside the box. And depending on where you went to college, a lot of colleges are teaching you to follow and comply. You know, I was fortunate I went to a liberal arts school where we were encouraged to challenge the professor's challenge the administration, right. It's not fun to be that person. But we were encouraged to question and go, Wait a minute, wait a minute. So I was fortunate in that way, because a lot of places are like no, listen, and then regurgitate what I say.

Dustin Steffey: 23:23

Well, now I'm jealous. I want your education over mine. I wanted to challenge people. I was part of the you go to school, and you learn this and you don't challenge a damn thing.

Bob Wheeler: 23:34

I challenged a lot. So I

Dustin Steffey: 23:37

think if I were to have a do over again and be in a challenging school, I would be that guy that like the admin and the professors are like, Dude, you're out a challenge cards today.

Bob Wheeler: 23:47

You've challenged me enough. Exactly, exactly.

Dustin Steffey: 23:51

I love a good debate. I too, like you wanted to be a lawyer until I figured out what it entailed. And I was like, Yeah, nevermind, I'll just never get my doctorate in business. It's at works. Yeah, it works. I'm still a doctor, whatever. Exactly. So all right, we touched base on patterns that you're seeing how? I guess for me, what I'm trying to wrap my head around is how did you get to this point to really understand and be able to consult your clients in the psychology and kind of the emotional part of spending money? What sparked you to do this? Was there some life event that happened to you that made you like, say, You know what, I need to evaluate myself?

Bob Wheeler: 24:42

Well, I got my CPA license, and even then I was still like, Are you sure? Like I still doubted right? I'm not enough. I'm not enough. I went to a school with a lot of wealthy kids and was the poor kid. Wasn't the kid with, you know, driving up in a Porsche and I think what happened is I got out of school, I had all this promise I was gonna go out and save the world. And then the reality sets in, it's Oh, I don't have all the tools, I don't have some of the tools that my friends had, or the generation generational wealth that my friends had. And so as I was working in the accounting world, you know, in giving people advice, and telling them, You should take 10%, you should do this, you should do that, or this would be really helpful. And inside, I'm going, Yeah, I wish I was doing that. I shouldn't be doing that, too. But I'm the exception to the rule. It's not going to work for me, I'll do it later, I had all the same excuses everybody else did. So realize, well, one, I'm not gonna lie, I'm not congruent with what I'm saying. Because I'm not doing, I'm not walking the talk. And I have lots of really valid great excuses that were just would make you cry, you know, so I was totally justified. And then I think, you know, as I started looking at my story, I also got into somatic therapy, which is body based therapy, and starting to learn about how we carry trauma, and all, all of our emotions, right that we hold, and people have heart attacks, and people have health issues over things that we're holding on to and we feel it. And so I spent 10 years, getting certified in somatic therapy and working in that area as well. And really with the intention to start to connect money in emotion. So in the program, I was always trying to tie it back to money. And so many people would come in, even though they were wealthy, or didn't matter, their backgrounds, everybody had a story to tell me. And, you know, I'd go give a talk, and I'd have 30 people follow me to the parking lot. I was like, oh, people want to talk about this. Because there hasn't been a lot of safe places to talk about, oh, my God, my credit card debts $100,000, I filed bankruptcy, I haven't paid the mortgage in three, three months, it's probably gonna get foreclosed on, I had to pull the kids out of private school because there's no money, and all the shame. And while we're busy trying to present really well, and hoping nobody finds out our secrets. And so that's where I just said, you know, what, I want to start being vulnerable, sharing my secrets, and letting people know that, that it's a safe place, because I've been there too. It's not that I did it perfect. It's because I made lots and lots of mistakes, that I can have empathy and compassion and want to help people have a different outcome.

Dustin Steffey: 27:34

And that brings up number four on that little bullet point. So we have self awareness, balanced constructive criticism, and then the willingness to share your losses, and have that and and build on that empathy. I think that right now, I mean, we're building some importance here, right? With the concepts that are we're discussing. And it's important. I think, money. Money, to me is a necessary thing, no matter what, like for sure, you have to be able to have some form of it to be able to move forward in anything in life right now. Until money disappears. And we're barter and blood, which I'm limited on that to exactly. I think like we have to come to grips with the realization that what we have is what we have, if I make 100 grand a year, then I really need to budget where's that 100 grand going Now, mind you, a lot of it goes into taxes and the government. Right? So you, you're Yeah, you're making 100 grand on paper, but you're really making about 22 to 25% less than that sometimes more. If you're in California paying state tax you're making like, really 60% of that. 100 grand. So yeah, seriously, seriously, I Yeah, it's insane. And it's insane. And so we really like it, I think you hit the nail right on the head with the fact that the first step is identifying what type of a spender Are you you? Can you save and be frugal? Or do you like the lavish things in life which there is no right or wrong? I like the lavish things in life. I'm not gonna lie. Yeah. But I also know when I don't have enough money to and so you have to identify first and then make choices from that. And then you start reaping the benefits or the consequences.

Bob Wheeler: 29:26

Absolutely. And I think it's so important to ask yourself is my ego tied to my story? Because if my ego says, I've got everybody, everybody needs to see how much I travel, everybody needs to see that I eat lavish meals. And then I'm really focused on how I present instead of saying, You know what, I can't afford that meal today. I'm not going to be able to do that. That's where we make hard choices. You know, I was talking to this guy was a financial advisor and making millions of dollars. They lost everything. And he literally had to go and collect recyclables out of the trash cans and stuff. Now the difference is he was willing to go. Alright, I guess I'll be pulling cans out of out of garbage bags. His ego was like saying I'm so above this, but his bank account said you're actually not. And his willingness to for a year or two be uncomfortable. And step back, instead of saying no, my ego says go into more depth. So everybody's impressed with me, is really what helped him pivot into a much more secure place, because he's willing to be honest, and most of us aren't.

Dustin Steffey: 30:37

Yeah, I agree with that. Sometimes I look at myself, and I have to have a hard conversation hard look in the mirror at myself, and make better choices with respect to money. I mean, I'm not the best with money. I do keep a roof over my child's head in my head, and I do pay the bills. But I know I can do better. I mean, we talk all the time on this podcast, about investing in generational wealth. Yep. So that way, you're setting up like your sons, your daughters, whatever you have, and yourself up for success, because no one's gonna do it for you. I am not a trust fund baby. And neither is my daughter. But her and I together can have the conversations, Hey, Daddy has an extra 100 bucks this month, you want to invest it into your savings or into your crypto or whatever? And they answer yay or nay? Or do you want to go to wild waters? You know what I mean? Right?

Bob Wheeler: 31:33

Yeah, absolutely. Well, we do have to have these conversations. And when it comes to generation, generational wealth, there's a lot of people that say, Yeah, everybody's family, but mine, right? And then we've got to break that. So that we can say, Ah, I'm going to be the person that is the transformational person in my family. I'm going to be the first one to go to college, I'm going to be the first one that gets to 100,000. I'm going to be the first one gets to a million dollars, and and then that actually gives permission to everybody else in the family say, Yeah, I don't want that either. I want something new. I don't want to stay in this poverty mindset. I'm ready to move on to something different.

Dustin Steffey: 32:13

Yeah, I agree with you. So again, that all goes back to telling your story, building that empathy, and having that constructive criticism, not only from others, but from yourself, too. And I believe that as individuals, we are our hardest critics. I do believe that because you even brought it up. The biggest pattern you see, is people waiting to prove themselves wrong.

Bob Wheeler: 32:38

Yeah. Yeah, we are. We are our biggest critics. And I think that's the, the piece of this, when you start looking at your history, seen how you were socialized, seeing what information you picked up that maybe your sibling didn't, right, I interpreted differently than a sibling. To just look at all that and be gentle with ourselves. Just go, oh, man, I didn't have a lot of information. At the time I made that decision. Right? We can be a little kinder ourselves instead of like, how stupid you didn't have the resources, but you did it anyway. Well, I didn't know. And so just to be a little kinder, and just a lot more curious. Wow, that's interesting.

Dustin Steffey: 33:17

I think the interesting part to me is before you, I didn't think about the emotional side, to how my spending habits are, what emotions I've been going through, whether it be I emotionally broke up with someone, and now I'm just gonna go and spend a bunch of money or whatever the case may be, or even like, how my mood affects how I spend money. So like a lot of people are emotions. They like to eat right? Well, that ties into money, too, because you're paying more money to eat more food when it's just an emotional driven response.

Bob Wheeler: 33:55

Well, absolutely. Which then ties into I eat so much that I started having health issues now I've got to pay for medical, or maybe I don't have a good insurance policies, and am I out of pocket deductibles gone up? Right? There's, there's so many ways if I'm eating unhealthy food, I made the I save a few bucks now, but in the long run, I'm paying for it with my health, because I'm just doing sugar, or whatever it might be. And again, there's no oh, that's wrong. We all have to find what works for us and find that balance. But the willingness to look and say that some places where I self sabotage, when I work with people with money and stuff, I'll say what are the goals you want? And they'll tell me this goal, that goal, that goal? And then the second question is, how do you plan on self sabotage and all of that? And it's amazing because people Oh, I'll do this and then I'm going to do this. And then I'm going to take myself out over here. Well, at least if I know your game plan to wipe yourself out, when you start to do it and go isn't that Oh, that's right. Right. But if we don't know the tools we're going to use to take ourselves out. We're gonna miss them when we start doing it when we start taking ourselves out

Dustin Steffey: 35:05

well it point number five write down the list of self sabotaging strategies that you are good at, because that's probably what's happening.

Bob Wheeler: 35:14

That's probably what's gonna happen.

Dustin Steffey: 35:16

It's, it's, it's fun that you mentioned that because it's not something that I would like right out. But I feel because I'm a writer, I love writing. I love producing I love doing our podcast, right. So if I write something out, usually I follow it. Well, yeah. All right, cool. So right now, I'm going to McDonald's to get a cheeseburger because I'm in a bad mood. Yep. That's self sabotage. Right there, Chad. Right. And he did not do that.

Bob Wheeler: 35:44

Yeah, exactly. And at least if you know it, it doesn't mean that sometimes you won't succumb to the pressure. And you'll have that information so that when it starts happening a lot, you can go, ah, boy, that happens a lot more than I want to admit.

Dustin Steffey: 35:58

It all ties back to bullet point number one, which is self awareness,

Bob Wheeler: 36:02

self awareness, self awareness, self aware, self aware.

Dustin Steffey: 36:06

So the last bullet, I think that's important to just round everything off is doing your own research, obviously, making sure that you can educate yourself to get that awareness. You have courses and books, you want to talk about those?

Bob Wheeler: 36:22

Sure, absolutely. Well, we do. There's a great book called The Money nerve, which is a great book to read with a partner, spouse, kids, to sort of figure out your your money, Map Your Money Story, and then make that decision to stay the course, or make a shift if it's not serving you. And so that's a really great way to start to get aware of your history. There's a lot of calls to actions at the end of each chapter. And, and for a lot of people, you know, if they're willing to spend that little bit of money, the ebooks, 399, right, and they can go through with somebody and start, especially with a spouse or partner figuring out the trigger points around money. You'd love to discuss it. I don't I like whatever. There's things I love to spend money you don't. How do we navigate that together and get on the same page? That's one thing, then we do have the online courses you can there's four different modules, you can get the whole, all four modules at a discounted rate, and basically journeys you through every day, starting to excavate the history starting to look at culturally, what did I learn religiously, if I grew up in a religious community, all those different things, just starting to go through and figuring out my stories, and then deciding how do I want to move forward?

Dustin Steffey: 37:48

Those are some great resources. And I'll have links below in our episode description. So if anybody wants to go through and take a look at those and maybe purchase those sounds like great things to start stepping in the right direction.

Bob Wheeler: 38:02

Yeah, and we I'm actually excited. I just started a children's book series called financially fit kids with a Z. I've got eight, eight books in process, the first one launches in November. But basically, I wanted to write books. So when I was a kid, I didn't know I could say no, because my parents would just slap me and go, the answer is yes. And I couldn't change my mind. If I got the information and went, Oh, bad decision. You're stuck with your decision. And so I wrote these books that just have foundational pieces in there that you it's okay to change your mind. It's okay to want things. It's okay to set goals. And so, in the first book, Darius wants a dog. But at the end of the day, when he finally his parents give him permission, he's like, I don't want a dog. Like we've already been through everything they do a trial run with with his aunt's dog and, and realizes, wow, cost money. It's the responsibility I got to put my time in. Yeah, I think I'll do that later. But initially wanted to dog because his friends had pets. Right? Oh, that's cool. They have it, I want it. And so, for me, these stories are just ways for kids to have a fun story, but also learn some foundational skill sets. So I'm excited about that as well.

Dustin Steffey: 39:20

That's great. I'm excited about that release into I think the most important thing that we can do right now as a generation for me and even for you, is to help our kids have a better foundation for when they grow and they're in our they're in our positions.

Bob Wheeler: 39:38

Absolutely. And that's right now it's something like 80 something percent of the people feel like financial literacy should be mandatory. And most people don't talk about money because they didn't get the lessons and so they don't want to embarrass themselves in front of their kids. But the best thing you could do is start saying I didn't get the lessons. Let's figure out how we can help you get ahead of where I was.

Dustin Steffey: 40:00

That's some great stuff. I, if you have a link for that, I will make sure that's in the description as well, too. I think that's of the utmost importance. Absolutely. It's

Bob Wheeler: 40:09

all the money nerves.com And all those resources, the books, the courses, and there's a lot of free words, reef, a lot of free resources in there as well.

Dustin Steffey: 40:19

Awesome, we will definitely have that on the episode description. Bob, if anyone wants to get a hold of you, I know I give everyone an opportunity to talk about that. What are some good mediums to get a hold of you and kind of reach out for help and kind of say hi, and see how you're doing?

Bob Wheeler: 40:35

Absolutely. So the money nerves.com. Any RV, not nerd. I'm a money nerd. But it's the money nirv.com That's the best place because you can reach me through email, you can get the resources. You can all also follow us on social media, at Bob Wheeler with two R's. Because one hour was taken Bob Wheeler with two hours or at money you should ask, which is the name of my podcast, where I talk with successful people about their failures, and their lessons. And so all of that those are the best ways to get me. I love connecting with people and just hearing where people are in their financial journey. That's amazing.

Dustin Steffey: 41:20

I hope that some of our listeners reach out to you because that's the joy that I see in everything is people connecting with people. Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. The last thing I want to do it, it's not a game, but it kind of is a game because it rolls up into the category of leaving gold nuggets, right? I always ask at the end. If there's one big piece of advice that you want to give or words of wisdom that you want to leave on the table. What would that be?

Bob Wheeler: 41:51

So I would say it's my what, why why what exercise? What Why, why what? What do I want? Why do I want it? Why don't I have it? What am I willing to do? To have it? So it might be I want something because it'll make people think I'm really cool. Why don't I have it? Because I'm not really cool? I don't know, right? And then what am I willing to do? I'm willing to let go of my ego, I'm willing to let go of my fear. Am I willing to ask for help. And so if I can look, it's really important to know why I want something. It could be the shallowest reason. But if I know that, at least then I know why I want to get where I want to get. So I don't want to shame. Even the, you know, there's a guy who's like, I want to have really fancy stuff, I feel better about myself. So that motivated him to go out and buy really expensive cars at a high discount, like auctions and things like that. So the his motivator was, I want to look like I have cool expensive stuff, but I can't afford it. So knowing that what why, why what is a great way when you're looking at stuff, why do I want that house? Why I want to put money away for college, all those things?

Dustin Steffey: 43:11

I think that's great. I think that can be used for life in general, I see that most business that I've learned, I can use it in more than one facet.

Bob Wheeler: 43:21

Absolutely. Absolutely. Absolutely. Bob,

Dustin Steffey: 43:25

it's been an awesome time just having you on I had a lot of fun just going through. And there were a lot of light bulb moments for me as well that I didn't think about until this interview. And so really, I appreciate having you on and I appreciate the value that you've added to our podcast and the listeners.

Bob Wheeler: 43:45

Well, so happy to be here. I appreciate you having me. I guess we'll catch Jayden next time. But

Dustin Steffey: 43:51

yeah, yeah, for sure. You know how he is he busy.

Bob Wheeler: 43:55

He you know how it is. But yeah, it's been great. I appreciate it. Appreciate the opportunity. Talk about money because people are not alone. And we all need to work through our our financial shame issues. So

Dustin Steffey: 44:07

don't be scared to talk about it. That's kind of the biggest thing that I learned from you because then it opens the door for me to course correct.

Bob Wheeler: 44:14

Absolutely. And it gives other people permission to know that they don't have to be perfect.

Dustin Steffey: 44:19

Yes, that is the lesson that I'm leaving on the table today which is nobody's perfect. So let's stop operating like we are and start moving forward. Absolutely. Thank you Bob for everything, absolutely. Hey, you Yes, you could just finish listening to our awesome episode. Jaden, and I wanted to remind you, if you go into the description of the episode, there will be a link that says ticket event live event sales. If you want to come and see Jaden and I in Fort Collins, Colorado on November 18 at 5pm Please go ahead, click on the link and book your tickets today. This event is going to be one for the end of the year. It's going to include and encompass smart investment strategies with keynote speakers such as Patrick hikkim, Derwin Logan, Jeff Litecoin, leader, and other relevant speakers to help add value. So if you are interested, please head on over to the link and book your tickets Today.